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Re: [STDS-802-11-ARC] [STDS-802-11-TGAX] Personal comments on 11-17/1220 (Clause 10.2 Comment Resolution)

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TGax/ARC folks,


As a starting point for the discussion in ARC, Tuesday AM2 (and TGax folks please join us if you can afford a few minutes to duck out of your ad hoc meeting – we’ll start right away in the slot and finish as soon as possible), I’ve collected my comments below into a document:, heavily based on Osama’s 11-17/1220r2.


Please let me know if anyone has comments, especially if you can’t attend the ARC slot.



From: Osama AboulMagd [mailto:Osama.AboulMagd@xxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2017 5:36 PM
To: Mark Hamilton <mark.hamilton2152@xxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGAX@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [STDS-802-11-TGAX] Personal comments on 11-17/1220 (Clause 10.2 Comment Resolution)


Hi Mark,


Thanks for your comments and timely review. Some answers to your questions/comments are embedded below.





From: *** 802.11 TGax - HEW - High Efficiency WLAN *** [mailto:STDS-802-11-TGAX@xxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Mark Hamilton
Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2017 6:38 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGAX@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [STDS-802-11-TGAX] Personal comments on 11-17/1220 (Clause 10.2 Comment Resolution)




I have scheduled time for the ARC SC to look at the 11ax changes to clause 10.2, and in particular 11-17/1220r2, next week.  But, both in preparation for that meeting, and in response to a suggestion to make comments available ASAP, here are some comments “ad hoc”.  I hope that’s helpful.


  1. In general, this looks to be heading in the correct direction to me.  Thanks!
  2. I note that the text proposed in 11-17/1220r2 for the new subclause 10.2.5a is not really parallel to the baseline for similar subclauses.  It would be good to start with something like:
    1. “An HE STA also implements the coordination function called MUCF.

[osama] an early revision included a similar statement. It is ok to add it.

  1. It is not clear to me (although I’m sure someone on this list can explain readily) whether the MUCF includes the EDCA access used to transmit the Trigger Frame (or a frame that contains an UL MU Response Scheduling A-Control subfield).  That is, wouldn’t these frames be sent using the regular EDCA access (which is still present, operating in parallel to the MUCF)?  The MUCF seems to be intended for the responding STA sending its HE trigger-based PPDU only.  I would change the wording in 10.2.5a (in 11-17/1220r2) to not list the contention based channel access or EDCA operations as part of the MUCF.

[osama] As the modified Figure implies, EDCA is part of MUCF. The thinking is EDCA is used, for example, by the AP to acquire the medium as usual and then start a DL MU transmission. I am ok if you feel EDCA is running in parallel and there is no need to include it in the MUCF.

  1. Assuming #3 is acceptable/agreed, the replacement for Figure 10-1 becomes much simpler, as it just needs the one box for MUCF added.  This box could have the MUCF label across the top, where (in 11-17/1220r2) it now has “UL MU Access”.

[osama] agree with your conclusion.

  1. If an opinion is desired on whether the MUCF should be one box or two, or one box with the two inside it (as in 11-17/1220r2), my personal opinion is that one box with the two inside it seems appropriate, given how different the UMTA and UORA channel accesses are, but that they are both under the MUCF “umbrella” of support for non-contention UL MU channel access. 

Osama] agreed



My two cents, and worth less than that…


I’m open to any questions/feedback, and/or any guidance for discussion within ARC SC next week.  Unfortunately, I note that all 3 ARC meeting slots are in conflict with some AX slot(s).  If anyone from TGax would like to attend, and has a time suggestion that would be easier, let me know, I can be flexible with ARC’s agenda.  I know Osama has requested that any feedback come as early in the week as possible, also.


[osama] I can attend an ARC time slot if it is during one of AX parallel (ad hoc) time slots. Can you please schedule the discussion at the beginning of the time slot you choose.


Thanks.  Mark


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