RE: contributions for upcoming May 2004 meeting - ARID
doh... I may made a stupid mistake in my previous mail.
Sorry Sungjin Lee (I guess his nickname is Steve).
non-english speaker made this mistake, sorry once more.
- Daniel (Soohong Daniel Park)
- Mobile Platform Laboratory, SAMSUNG Electronics.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-stds-802-21@listserv.ieee.org
> [mailto:owner-stds-802-21@listserv.ieee.org] On Behalf Of S.
> Daniel Park
> Sent: Friday, April 30, 2004 11:42 AM
> To: 'Mike MORETON'; 'Clint Chaplin'; stds-802-21@ieee.org;
> dj.johnston@intel.com; stephen.mccann@ROKE.CO.UK;
> steve.lee@SAMSUNG.COM
> Cc: ajayrajkumar@LUCENT.COM; kimps@SAMSUNG.COM
> Subject: RE: contributions for upcoming May 2004 meeting - ARID
>
>
> > Maybe Steve should add looking at this issue in a 802.11
> generic way
> > as part of his PAR... Or could FR do it?
>
> Mike, I don't know what you mean by *Steve* and his PAR.
> It means steve.lee@samsung.com ?
>
> Sorry it's too stupid question...:-)
>
> - Daniel (Soohong Daniel Park)
> - Mobile Platform Laboratory, SAMSUNG Electronics.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Mike MORETON [mailto:mike.moreton@st.com]
> > Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 7:45 PM
> > To: 'Clint Chaplin'; stds-802-21@ieee.org; dj.johnston@intel.com;
> > stephen.mccann@ROKE.CO.UK; soohong.park@SAMSUNG.COM;
> > steve.lee@SAMSUNG.COM
> > Cc: ajayrajkumar@LUCENT.COM; kimps@SAMSUNG.COM
> > Subject: RE: contributions for upcoming May 2004 meeting - ARID
> >
> >
> > Clint,
> >
> > I'd say that's an internal issue for 802.11. I'd be
> surprised if the
> > additional information added by 802.21 made the difference.
> >
>
> >
> > Mike.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Clint Chaplin [mailto:cchaplin@sj.symbol.com]
> > Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 7:49 PM
> > To: stds-802-21@ieee.org; dj.johnston@intel.com;
> > stephen.mccann@ROKE.CO.UK; soohong.park@SAMSUNG.COM;
> > steve.lee@SAMSUNG.COM; mike.moreton@ST.COM
> > Cc: ajayrajkumar@LUCENT.COM; kimps@SAMSUNG.COM
> > Subject: RE: contributions for upcoming May 2004 meeting - ARID
> >
> > Yes, the beacon is extensible in the way you recommend, but I
> > think the issue is more pragmatic: just how big do we want to
> > make the beacon?
> > It's already pretty darn large and growing, and with multiple
> > BSSIDs sharing a single radio for multi-BSSID setups, the
> > beacon time is becoming a fair fraction of the total available time.
> >
> > Clint (JOATMON) Chaplin
> >
> > >>> Mike MORETON <mike.moreton@ST.COM> 4/28/04 01:10:18 >>>
> > All,
> >
> > In some senses anyone can extend the 802.11 beacon as there
> > is now an OUI based extension mechanism. So for example, the
> > WiFi alliance's WPA security extension to 802.11 uses an IE
> > identified with (as I remember) the Microsoft OUI.
> >
> > So if 802.21 get an OUI allocated to them (probably not
> > difficult) they could add whatever they want to the 802.11 beacon.
> >
> > I would suggest that it would be best to go slightly beyond
> > that and get 802.11 to allocate a specific IE for 802.21 use.
> > 802.21 could then create their own "sub-type" field, and
> > have whatever IEs they wanted.
> >
> > I don't think it's a good idea to get 802.11 to add a new IE
> > for specific 802.21 features (in this case ARID) as that
> > imposes a maintenance headache for the future.
> >
> > Mike.
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-stds-802-21@listserv.ieee.org
> > [mailto:owner-stds-802-21@listserv.ieee.org] On Behalf Of
> Johnston, Dj
> > Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 4:08 AM
> > To: S. Daniel Park; steve.lee@SAMSUNG.COM; McCann, Stephen;
> > stds-802-21
> > Cc: ajayrajkumar@LUCENT.COM; Pyungsoo Kim; cchaplin@symbol.com
> > Subject: RE: contributions for upcoming May 2004 meeting - ARID
> >
> > Daniel,
> >
> > There are four potential venues I can think of.
> >
> > 802.21 is an obvious place, since this is a small item of L3
> > context information that can be used for optimization of the
> > handover process, regardless of the media type. In fact I
> > think you will find 802.21 to be fairly receptive to this
> > idea, since I remember the ARID being discussed several times
> > as a suitable thing to include in the handover information
> > that 802.21 could make available.
> >
> > 802.16e or 802.16 Netman may want to adopt this as an
> > efficiency measure.
> >
> > 802.11r 'Fast BSS Transition' may or may not want to address
> > this, based on a determination of whether the ARID could
> > change during a BSS transition.
> >
> > 802.11 WIEN has something of a cellular interworking angle.
> > If Mobile IP is the unifying medium in an 802.11/cellular
> > interworking scenario that WIEN ultimately addresses, the
> > some representation of the ARID would be appropriate.
> >
> > Within 802.21 and 802.16 I see no conflict. It is appropriate
> > for the same information to be available by both means. The
> > point of supporting it in 802.16 would be that it could be
> > passed at a lower layer and thus in a more timely fashion
> > than 802.21 might achieve over that medium.
> >
> > Within 802.11, I suspect you do not need more than one group
> > to address this, so its one of either 802.11r or WIEN. Given
> > Steve's input, it looks like WIEN might be keen to help out.
> >
> > So I suggest you bring this to 802.21 as a proposal for an
> > item of 'media independent handover information' that we
> > should support and provide the necessary information relating
> > to its use and semantics.
> >
> > In 802.16, I suggest steering clear of 802.16e, they are
> > heavily into a comment resolution cycle and don't have room
> > for new material. The 802.16 Netman SG in the medium term is
> > likely to lead to a PAR that addresses optimized mobility
> > procedures. I have ARID advertisments on my list of things to
> > address in Netman and so we may have time to discuss this in
> > the July meeting in Portland. If you are going to Shenzen for
> > the 802.16 meeting in May, then you are welcome to bring it
> > up as a scope item for Netman.
> >
> > In 802.11, take it to WIEN.
> >
> > DJ
> > 802.16 Netman SG chair
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-stds-802-21@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
> > [mailto:owner-stds-802-21@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG] On Behalf Of S.
> > Daniel Park
> > Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 6:13 PM
> > To: steve.lee@samsung.com; 'McCann, Stephen'; 'stds-802-21'
> > Cc: ajayrajkumar@LUCENT.COM; 'Pyungsoo Kim'
> > Subject: RE: contributions for upcoming May 2004 meeting - ARID
> >
> >
> > Steve, please see my inline comments.
> >
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Sungjin Lee [mailto:steve.lee@samsung.com]
> > > Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 9:48 AM
> > > To: 'S. Daniel Park'; 'McCann, Stephen'; 'stds-802-21'
> > > Cc: ajayrajkumar@LUCENT.COM; 'Pyungsoo Kim'
> > > Subject: RE: contributions for upcoming May 2004 meeting - ARID
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Daniel, Stephen and all HO guys
> > >
> > > In my understanding, that kind of issue (e.g. ARID into
> > > beacon) is fit to be discussed within 802.21. The ARID formant,
> > > recommended usage examples and scenarios also could be
> > discussed and
> > > then put into the documentation released as 802.21 spec. based on
> > > agreement between 802.21 attendees.
> > >
> > > However, the specific way to provide that ARID
> information over the
> > > air interface should be discussed within each WG. In
> fact, It sould
> > be
> >
> > > discussed within 802.11 WG to propose the changed Beacon frame
> > > structure including ARID and within 802.16 to propose the changed
> > > DL-MAP or NBR-ADV message including ARID.
> >
> > It was my original question, so I guess this work is useful
> > for related WG such as 802.11, 802.16 but the contribution
> > should be discussed in the 80.21, of course we have to get
> > the agreement of 802.11 to insert ARID into the beacon. Of
> > course we have to get the agreement of 802.16 if ARID would
> > be applied for 802.16.
> >
> > correct ? or am I missing anything ?
> >
> > I am not sure how I can get the agreement of 802.11 to
> > insert ARID into the beacon. Do I have to propose it to the
> > 802.11 as a document ? or 802.21 can be responsible for this
> > collaboration. I am so curious...
> >
> >
> > Regards.
> >
> > - Daniel (Soohong Daniel Park)
> > - Mobile Platform Laboratory, SAMSUNG Electronics.
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > __________
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> >
> >
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