Re: [802-11WG] untestable PICS items
There are references, as I previously stated. Most of those, who
argue the most or are influential, know they exist, but can not use them
to support their arguments (and in many case override their positions),
which is why others are left wondering if there are references.
A PICS Proforma cannot state anything that is not supported by the
specification to which it is part or when it is a stand alone
document.
In this sense the PICS Proforma contains redundant information and is not
needed.
"The ICS proforma is a normative document to express in compact from
the static conformance requirements of a specification."
ITU-T Recommendation X.296
David Cypher
========================
At 09:08 PM 3/24/2008, Jim Petranovich wrote:
--- This message came from the
IEEE 802.11 Working Group Reflector --- David,
I am glad you are bringing this up, and I hope either someone will find a
reference for these PICS proforma "requirements", a committee
will formalize the requirements, or we will abandon them.
I do not believe the PICS to be valuable, but perhaps someone has found
otherwise.
Jim Petranovich
On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 1:23 PM, David Cypher
<david.cypher@nist.gov>
wrote:
- --- This message came from the IEEE 802.11 Working Group Reflector
---
- For example,
- There is no IEEE 802 requirement that a standard contain a
PICS Proforma and is there for not a valid reason for a NO vote for a
standard not containing one.
- [RR] Very interesting … thanks for this
clarification.
- These is no IEEE 802 that mandates a PICS Proforma question
for every "Shall" or "may"
- [RR] I had heard this, but have also
heard the contrary.
- There is no requirement that every PICS Proforma question be
testable. As Bob O'Hara stated.
- [RR] This is where the issue gets
interesting in my opinion. I'd love to get a good handle on this so
I know how to write the standard and PICS items
properly.
- For the IEEE 802 statements:
- You see, it is very easy to prove me wrong in my statements.
For those who tell you that the statements I have made are false, only
have to show there existence. I have asked some those people who
claim that my statements are false, but they are unable to produce
them.
- You know it is quite easy to verify this for yourself, so that you
know better when confronted and no not have to accept my word.
There is a list of the ruling documents from IEEE-SA and IEEE 802 and
most working groups within 802 have a list too. If PICS does not
show up in any of these, then I guess my statements are true. If
not, you will have found and be able to site the referenced document(s)
and clause(s) for myself and others to know. I wish you well on
your search.
- A counter example to a non-existence statement is to show
existence.
- David Cypher
-
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