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Re: [HSSG] 40G MAC Rate Discussion



Title:

Shimon,

"What has been puzzling to me in this debate ever since it started is:
how can 40Gb server connectivity in the datacenter hurt those of you who believe that 100Gb is the right speed for aggregation links in service provider networks? I am certainly at a point where I understand and respect the needs of your market. All I am asking in return is the same."

I believe I may have stated this during the meetings, but will be happy to reiterate. First off, I should mention that aggregation is not just for service providers, but high performance data centers are in need of 100G aggregation *asap* as well.

If we have a 40G and 100G MACs defined, it creates an additional set of IC/product solutions that must be developed.

Imagine the following;

Nx10G + Mx100G + (opt) Fabric I/O (Required for a 10G/100G Server/Uplink solution)
Nx100G + Fabric I/O (Switch Aggregator Functionality)

So, to solve the customer demand for higher density 10G with uplink solutions, we are likely to need two chips and the products they spawn.

Now, If we add 40G into the mix;

Nx10G + Mx40G + (opt) Fabric I/O (Required for a 10G/40G Server/Uplink solution)
Nx40G + Mx100G + (opt) Fabric I/O (Required for a 40G/100G Server/Uplink solution)
Nx40G + Fabric I/O (Switch Aggregator Functionality)
Nx100G + Fabric I/O (Switch Aggregator Functionality)

So, we have essentially doubled the product development requirements to meet a wider, and thus more shallow customer demand for server interconnect and aggregation products.

Now, I am open to the concept that a multi-speed MAC could be defined which is scaled upon the PHY lane capacity, but this is a substantial change from our current paradigm and the development for that approach will likely slow down the standard, add risk on the spec, and delay the availability of 100G which I already said is needed in some of our high-performance data centers today.

 
I hope this helps to open the discussion and look forward to your questions/response.

Dan

------------ Previous Message Below ------------

-----Original Message-----
From: Shimon Muller [mailto:Shimon.Muller@Sun.COM]
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 4:52 PM
To: STDS-802-3-HSSG@listserv.ieee.org
Subject: Re: [HSSG] 40G MAC Rate Discussion

Thank you for the clarification, John.

On that point, as someone who started the 40Gb discussion back in January, I would like to make it clear in no uncertain terms what our motivations were and still are: in no way do we intend to impede or slow down the development and/or the adoption of 100Gb Ethernet.

We believe that doing a standard for 100Gb is important but not enough, for the following reasons:
- The 40Gb speed will enable us to get the most out of our servers until 100Gb becomes technically and economically viable for server connectivity. We believe that there is a 5-year window of opportunity for this market.
- The two speeds should be addressing two distinct markets. This can be accomplished by defining the PMDs based on reach, with 40Gb defined for short-reach datacenter connectivity only.
- 40Gb connectivity at the server will require a faster aggregation speed even in the datacenter. This will increase the market potential for 100Gb.
- Unless the 100Gb effort starts today, the technology will not be ready when we need it for servers in 2015. I am sure your heard me say this at the last meeting, and I meant it.
- The development of a 40Gb standard will be highly leveraged: either from the work that was done in other standards bodies, or from the work that needs to be done for 100Gb anyway. Therefore, 40Gb should in no way slow down the 100Gb effort.

What has been puzzling to me in this debate ever since it started is:
how can 40Gb server connectivity in the datacenter hurt those of you who believe that 100Gb is the right speed for aggregation links in service provider networks? I am certainly at a point where I understand and respect the needs of your market. All I am asking in return is the same.

Any comments that will help me understand and address the above concerns would be very much appreciated.

Regards,

Shimon.



John DAmbrosia wrote On 03/30/07 19:48,:

> All,
>
> From discussions I have had, I sense that there may be some confusion
> regarding the proposal for adding a 40Gb/s MAC rate objecitve. 40 Gb/s
> has been proposed as an additional MAC rate, not as a replacement for
> the current objective of 100 Gb/s.
>
> The presentations given have focused on the needs of servers / end
> stations:
>
> http://grouper.ieee.org/groups/802/3/hssg/public/jan07/muller_01_0107.
> pdf
>
> http://grouper.ieee.org/groups/802/3/hssg/public/mar07/frazier_01_0307
> .pdf
>
> http://grouper.ieee.org/groups/802/3/hssg/public/mar07/vandoorn_01_030
> 7.pdf
>
> I encourage all to review the above presentations, and use the
> reflector to further discuss them and / or the proposed objective.
> This will help to assist the SG in preparing for the April Interim, as
> well as making decisions regarding the project’s objectives.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> John D’Ambrosia
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> --
>
> *From:* John DAmbrosia [mailto:jdambrosia@FORCE10NETWORKS.COM]
> *Sent:* Monday, March 26, 2007 5:11 PM
> *To:* STDS-802-3-HSSG@listserv.ieee.org
> *Subject:* [HSSG] 40G MAC Rate Discussion
>
> Dear HSSG Members,
>
> As discussed in the action plan pulled together at the end of the
> plenary week, further discussion on adding a 40G MAC rate as an
> objective is needed. Topics of interest include: economic feasibility,
> broad market potential, and what pmds are desired for this rate.
>
> I would like to encourage all to use the reflector for this subject
> matter, which could assist individuals in their preparations for the
> interim meeting next month.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> John D’Ambrosia
>