RE: [802SEC] Deadbeat rule change proposal
Let me put my 2 cents in:
In 220.127.116.11 item g of the LMSC rules we state that the Chairs of WGs can
collect fees to cover expenses.
The deadbeat rule as it stands deals with outstanding financial obligations
to LMSC. A WG Chair is a function of LMSC. Hence, I do not believe that we
need a rules change.
Agere Systems Nederland B.V., formerly Lucent Technologies
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From: Bill Quackenbush [mailto:email@example.com]
Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 5:12 AM
To: IEEE 802 SEC
Subject: Re: [802SEC] Deadbeat rule change proposal
Having written the proposed rule change, I may not be able to read it
objectively. However, I offer the following thoughts to this discussion.
Change to Section 2
The change to this section was to ALLOW the LMSC Treasurer to collect
fees from attendees at 802 sponsored interims. Strictly speaking, the
current wording does not allow the Treasurer to collect fees for any
interim meeting. The expenses for an 802 sponsored interim meeting ARE
expenses of operating 802. This authorizes the Treasurer to collect
fees for 802 sponsored interim meetings that are 802 operating expenses
and but not collect fees for 802 meetings that are sponsored by other
entities and are not 802 operating expenses. And since fees will not be
collected for meetings not sponsored by 802, the funds from those two
categories of meetings will not be comingled.
Given the reaction to this proposed change to Section 2, I suggest that
the sentence in question should be changed to something like
"The LMSC Treasurer may collect fees from all attendees of any
meeting held in conjuction with a Plenary session to cover the
expenses of the Plenary session and the expenses of operating
the LAN MAN Standards Committee". The LMSC Treasurer may collect
fees from all attendees of any meeting held in conjuction with an
LMSC sponsored interim meeting to cover the expenses of the interim
I see no reason the make the collection of fees mandatory. The will be
collected if they are needed.
The objection to placing any mention of fees for interims in this
section applies equally to any mention of fees for Plenary meetings as
the topic of the section is the opening (Monday morning) plenary
meeting. I simply added interims meetings to what was there to avoid
for the moment undertaking a more extensive reorganization of the rules
which they desperately need. The above two sentences can be moved to
another place in the rules if that is the desire of the SEC.
New Section 6
This section speaks of "LMSC standards development group or subgroup
meetings". i.e. meetings of an LMSC standards development group or
subgroup. It says nothing about who sponsored the meetings. Therefore,
this section applies equally to meetings sponsored by the LMSC and
meetings sponsored by other entities.
The last sentence of this section was added at the suggestion of another
SEC member. I believe that Bob Grow is correct in pointing out that
LMSC P&P 3.1,f applies here. Based on Bob's observation, the paragraph
needs to be modified. Perhaps the sentence should simply end with
"responsibility of the LMSC Treasurer and the LMSC Executive
The implementation of the policy should/must consider the input of the
Bob Love has suggested a "statue of limitations". While I am not a fan
of letting the basters off the hook, a window of maybe 5 or 7 years
might be useful to 802 in that it limits the length of time we need to
maintain our records.
Geoff Thompson wrote:
> I have some general problems with your proposal.
> RE the original form of the phrase:
> The LMSC Treasurer may collect fees from all attendees of any meeting
> held in conjunction with the a Plenary or Interim session to cover the
> expenses of operating the LAN MAN Standards Committee.
> ...probably needs to be updated from "may" to "shall".
> Either way, I don't think the modification for interims belongs here
> in the current context.
> It is not the job of the LMSC Treasurer to collect fees from an
> Interim session to cover the expenses of operating the LAN MAN
> Standards Committee.
> Rather, LMSC Treasurer through the conference organizer may collect
> fees from all attendees of an interim meeting to cover the expenses of
> the interim meeting.
> If we go with the currently proposed text then we are signing up for
> all sorts of grief about whose interims are supporting plenary
> operation and whose are not.
> Also, I am a little unhappy about a policy that is so completely rigid
> and has no provision for input from the affected WG Chair.
> At 04:35 PM 3/3/2003 -0800, Bill Quackenbush wrote:
> > All,
> > Attached is my first draft of the proposed deadbeat rule changes.
> > I have put the new material in a new section so that it applies
> > equally
> > to any LMSC standards development group meeting.
> > Your comments are encouraged.
> > Thanks,
> > wlq