Re: [802SEC] +++ LMSC P&P Revision Ballot +++ AudCom
Please change my vote to disapprove. In addition to comments already
submitted by others, much of which I support, please note the following:
188.8.131.52 (a) and 184.108.40.206 (a): "Decide which matters are procedural and
technical". This is incorrectly stated. I believe the intent is
"Decide which matters are procedural and which matters are
technical". Re-word accordingly.
220.127.116.11 (g) and 18.104.22.168 (g): "Set goals and deadlines and adhere to
them". Nice sentiment, but adherence to deadlines isn't necessarily
under the Chair's control. Re-word as "Set goals and deadlines".
22.214.171.124 I don't believe that giving a technical opinion is the only
reason that a Chair might wish to be recused. Change "i.e.," to "e.g.,".
At 22:19 24/06/2007, Roger B. Marks wrote:
>I vote Disapprove, with comments below. I'd like to acknowledge
>Phillip Barber, an 802.16 member who worked with me on these comments.
>I also support most of the disapprove comments I've seen from other
>The proposed 126.96.36.199 would be an extremely radical change to EC
>operation. Such a change is totally unwarranted and is not in any way
>motivated by the relevant rationale presented along with the ballot:
>"A clarification of the responsibilities of the Chair."
>In particular, the existing P&P defines the EC as a procedural body,
>not a technical body. For example, 7.1.1(e) gives the EC the
>authority to "Examine and approve Working Group draft standards for
>proper submission to Sponsor ballot group...; not for technical
>The proposed 188.8.131.52(a)(b)(c) would put all procedural issues in the
>hands of the EC Chair. What, if anything, does this leave to the EC?
>Given that the function of the EC is to administer the process,
>procedural decisions belong to the EC. It is inappropriate to
>delegate them to the Chair. It is the right and duty of the EC as a
>whole to make all such decisions, though they as a group may elect to
>delegate that right on individual matters.
>Finally, the LMSC Chair puts these matters to the LMSC EC members for
>vote, not to the WG Members.
>Modify the proposed changes as:
>184.108.40.206 LMSC Chair
>The LMSC Chair has the following responsibilities:
>a) Decide which matters are procedural and technical
>b) Decide procedural matters
>ca) Place technical issuesmatters to a vote by WGLMSC EC membership.
>db) Lead the participants according to all of the relevant policies
>ec) Entertain motions, but not make motions
>fd) Delegate necessary functions as needed
>ge) Set goals and deadlines and strive to adhere to them
>hf) Prioritize objectives to best serve the group and the goalsentire
>ig) Seek consensus of the Sponsor if required as a means of resolving
>The ballot rationale explains that one reason for the ballot is to
>address an AudCom concern regarding the need for " A better
>description of the rights of the participants and due process."
>This This AudCom requirement has not been met, or even addressed, by
>the proposed revisions. ANSI due process requirements apply to all
>those "with a direct and material interest", regardless of
>membership. I believe that AudCom is telling us to recognize those
>Add the following text at the end of 220.127.116.11:
>In addition, all participants, regardless of membership, shall be
>entitled to due process and have the rights to:
> (a) express a position and its basis
> (b) have that position be considered
> (c) appeal (7.1.6)
> (d) access information on the activities of the LMSC and its
>subgroups in a timely manner
> (e) bring matters to the attention of the group for consideration
>No action of the LMSC or of its officers shall abridge these rights.
>The ballot rationale relates to the rights of the participants and to
>the functions of the WG Chair. These issues intersect in 18.104.22.168,
>which specifies the Chair's function, giving the Chair extraordinary
>powers to rule matters as procedural and to decide procedural issues.
>To protect the rights of the members, the P&P should offer some
>specifications regarding the distinction between technical and
>In subclause 22.214.171.124 , modify the text as follow:
>126.96.36.199 Chair's Function
>The Chair of the Working Group decides procedural issues. The Working
>Group members and the Chair decide technical issues by vote. The
>Working Group Chair generally decides what is procedural and what is
>technical. However, any matter regarding the establishment or
>modification of a PAR or that would make a non-editorial change to a
>draft standard shall be a technical issue.
>The ballot rationale refers to "the lack of requirement to act in
>accordance with the IEEE Code of Ethics. This requirement for conduct
>should be added to the P&P." The proposed revision does not directly
>address this issue. It references the Code of Ethics only by adding
>material to 8.4; since 8.4 addresses sessions, the change would
>apparenty apply only to sessions. Furthermore, the proposed 8.4
>doesn't address the Code of Ethics at all; it simply says that
>participants will allow other participants "a fair and equal
>opportunity to contribute." This completely misses the point of the
>IEEE Code of Ethics.
>Eliminate the text "in accordance with the IEEE Code of Ethics" from
>the proposed addition of 8.4.
>Add a subclause 6.5:
>6.5 IEEE Code of Ethics
>All participants in the LMSC and its subgroups, regardless of
>membership status, shall act in accordance with the IEEE Code of Ethics.
>It is not within the power of the WG Chair to ensure that deadlines
>Modify the proposed changes as:
>188.8.131.52 LMSC Chair
>g) Set goals and deadlines and strive to adhere to them
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This email is sent from the 802 Executive Committee email reflector. This list is maintained by Listserv.