Re: [802SEC] +++un-conflicted EC motion #4 regarding 802.20+++determine Mark Klerer's unconflcted/conflicted classification+++need mover and seconder+++
Paul -
On reflection, I believe we are in deep weeds here with regard to procedure.
We (802) have no procedures in our P&P that define how an
unconflicted EC works; all we have with regard to the UC-EC is a set
of requirements imposed on us by the standards board. When they
invented the UC-EC, I don't think that the SB anticipated the current
situation at all - it was set up when Arnie was still Chair, so the
question didn't arise. And as Bob O'Hara was frequently called upon
to point out to us, we can't change our P&P simply by passing a
motion. So, I believe that the only way to fix this is through the SB
doing one of two things:
- Dissolving the UC-EC; or
- Making a ruling as to what rights an otherwise conflicted Chair of
802.20 might have when representing the wishes of his working group.
Or possibly by the EC Chair simply stating how he will interpret the
rules with regard to what a not-unconflicted Chair may do.
I would personally advocate the first of these three solutions.
Regards,
Tony
At 16:07 21/04/2008, Paul Nikolich wrote:
>Buzz,
>
>I disagree--we must be consistent in determining
>the classification. The determination of conflicted vs
>unconflicted must be made using the criteria I established in my
>3APR email (see extract below). This is consistent with how we have
>treated every EC member regarding their classification.
>
>Once we make the above decision, then we can take the second step.
>
>Regards,
>
>--Paul
>
>----- Original Message ----- From: Paul Nikolich
>Sent: Thursday, April 03, 2008 12:36 PM
>Subject: determination of unconflicted vs conflicted status of new EC members
>
>
>All,
>
>The criteria we shall use in classifying the new EC members as
>Unconflicted or Conflicted regarding 802.20 decisions:
>a) The "perception of conflict" is a test for disclosure: is the EC
>member aware of a fact (about himself or someone else) that would
>cause a reasonable person on the outside looking in to believe that
>the member had an interest in the outcome or for whatever reason was
>unable to decide in the best interest of the IEEE.
>b) The test for a determination of an "actual conflict" was whether
>there was in fact an interest that could prevent someone from making
>an unbiased decision.
>
>[...rest of email deleted...]
>
>
>----- Original Message ----- From: "Rigsbee, Everett O"
><everett.o.rigsbee@boeing.com>
>To: "Paul Nikolich" <paul.nikolich@ATT.NET>; <STDS-802-SEC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG>
>Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 10:46 AM
>Subject: RE: [802SEC] +++un-conflicted EC motion #4 regarding
>802.20+++determine Mark Klerer's unconflcted/conflicted
>classification+++need mover and seconder+++
>
>
>
>Paul, I think you have the right plan in the wrong order. I personally
>would be a lot more comfortable judging Mark (and other EC members) to
>be not Unconflicted if I was confident that they would be able to move
>and vote for WG directed positions. So I think we need to clarify what
>it means to be "not Unconflicted" before we vote on his status. Doesn't
>that make sense ??? :-)
>
>
>Thanx, Buzz
>Dr. Everett O. (Buzz) Rigsbee
>Executive Secretary, IEEE-802 LMSC
>Boeing IT
>PO Box 3707, M/S: 7M-FM
>Seattle, WA 98124-2207
>Ph: (425) 373-8960 Fx: (425) 865-7960
>Cell: (425) 417-1022
>everett.o.rigsbee@boeing.com
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Paul Nikolich [mailto:paul.nikolich@ATT.NET]
>Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 7:37 AM
>To: STDS-802-SEC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
>Subject: [802SEC] +++un-conflicted EC motion #4 regarding
>802.20+++determine Mark Klerer's unconflcted/conflicted
>classification+++need mover and seconder+++
>
>Dear UC-EC members,
>
>I think we must follow a two step process.
>- First, let's make the determination whether Mark Klerer is
>unconflicted or
>conflicted.
>- Second, we'll decide on how to handle his rights as either an
>unconflicte
>or conflicted EC member.
>
>To take the first step, I would recommend the following UC-EC motion be
>made
>by an UC-EC member:
>
>Motion: Mark Klere shall not be added to the Unconflicted EC roster.
>
>Do I have a mover and seconder?
>
>Regards,
>
>--Paul
>
>
>
>----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Jeffree" <tony@JEFFREE.CO.UK>
>To: <STDS-802-SEC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG>
>Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 8:23 AM
>Subject: Re: [802SEC] +++un-conflicted EC motion #4 regarding
>802.20+++determine Mark Klerer's unconflcted/conflicted
>classification+++need mover and seconder+++
>
>
>>I would second such a motion.
>>
>>Regards,
>>Tony
>>
>>
>>At 19:59 20/04/2008, Rigsbee, Everett O wrote:
>>>Paul, I much prefer the solution proposed by Roger Marks, that any
>>>conflicted EC-members be entitled to propose and vote in favor of
>>>motions submitted to them as directed positions from their Working
>>>Group. It just seems fairer and more even-handed. And I have offered
>>>to make a motion to that effect.
>>>
>>>
>>>Thanx, Buzz
>>>Dr. Everett O. (Buzz) Rigsbee
>>>Executive Secretary, IEEE-802 LMSC
>>>Boeing IT
>>>PO Box 3707, M/S: 7M-FM
>>>Seattle, WA 98124-2207
>>>Ph: (425) 373-8960 Fx: (425) 865-7960
>>>Cell: (425) 417-1022
>>>everett.o.rigsbee@boeing.com
>>>
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: Paul Nikolich [mailto:paul.nikolich@ATT.NET]
>>>Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2008 11:46 AM
>>>To: STDS-802-SEC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
>>>Subject: [802SEC] +++un-conflicted EC motion #4 regarding
>>>802.20+++determine Mark Klerer's unconflcted/conflicted
>>>classification+++need mover and seconder+++
>>>
>>>Dear Unconflicted EC members,
>>>
>>>There has been discussion over the past wek regarding the
>>>conflicted/un-conflicted classification of Mark Klerer, specifically
>>>that if
>>>he is not made a member of the UC-EC perhaps he should be given unique
>>>status regarding placing 802.20 WG motions before the UC-EC. I don't
>>>believe special status is needed to ensure fair and proper
>consideration
>>>of
>>>802.20 WG business by the UC-EC. A special status will only serve to
>>>complicate the unconflicted EC and conflicted EC classification
>process.
>>>If
>>>Mark is classified as conflicted, he will have the right to propose
>that
>>>an
>>>UC-EC member place a motion on the floor on his behalf, participate in
>>>crafting the motion language and voicing an opinion on changes to it.
>>>
>>>To that end, I'd like to propose the following motion:
>>>
>>>Motion: Mark Klere shall not be added to the Unconflicted EC roster
>and
>>>shall have the right to propose that an UC-EC member place a UC-EC
>>>motion on
>>>the floor on his behalf, participate in crafting the motion language
>and
>>>
>>>voicing an opinion on changes to it.
>>>
>>>I need a mover and and seconder for the above motion. Only UC-EC
>>>members
>>>may participate in the vote.
>>>
>>>Regards,
>>>
>>>--Paul Nikolich
>>>
>>>----------
>>>This email is sent from the 802 Executive Committee email reflector.
>>>This list is maintained by Listserv.
>>>
>>>----------
>>>This email is sent from the 802 Executive Committee email reflector.
>This
>>>list is maintained by Listserv.
>>
>>----------
>>This email is sent from the 802 Executive Committee email reflector.
>This
>>list is maintained by Listserv.
>
>----------
>This email is sent from the 802 Executive Committee email reflector.
>This list is maintained by Listserv.
>----------
>This email is sent from the 802 Executive Committee email
>reflector. This list is maintained by Listserv.
>
>
----------
This email is sent from the 802 Executive Committee email reflector. This list is maintained by Listserv.