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Re: [802SEC] Rebuttal and feedback to 802.19 and 802.22 on their Response to our PAR comments -- also 802.21


                IEEE 802.19 has adjourned for the week so we cannot make formal responses to the three rebuttal comments.

                However, I can personally attempt to answer the rebuttal comments.  These are only my personal responses and do not necessarily represent the responses of the 802.19 group.

Rebuttal Comment #1

*         It is the position of myself and of the 802.19 (I can say this since we discussed this during the meeting) that adoption of the 802.19.1 TVWS Coexistence standard should not be mandated by the EC.  I have told the 802.19 members that the standard needs to be valuable and attractive to adopt and that MAC/PHY standards should benefit from adopting the standard

*         It is true that if a MAC/PHY standard does adopt the 802.19.1 standard there will likely be some MAC/PHY capabilities that wound need to be supported.  For example, in order to change channel of operation to avoid mutual interference the MAC/PHY standard would need to support dynamic frequency selection (DFS) as is supported in 802.11h.

*         I hope that clarifies the issue

Rebuttal Comment #2

*         The 1900.4a PAR (IEEE Standard for Architectural Building Blocks Enabling Network-Device Distributed Decision Making for Optimized Radio Resource Usage in Heterogeneous Wireless Access Networks - Amendment: Architecture and Interfaces for Dynamic Spectrum Access Networks in White Space Frequency Bands) does not use the term "coexistence" in its PAR.

*         There was a presentation by the chair of 1900.4 in 802.19 on SCC41 and the P1900 series of projects (

*         My understanding of 1900.4 and the 1900.4a amendment is that it is focused on cellular network and is very high-level for managing networks

*         The 1900.4a as an amendment to 1900.4 to extend the Architecture and Interfaces to the White Space band

*         I hope that clarifies the issue

Rebuttal Comment #3

*         Since 802.19 has adjourned for the week I cannot just change the wording of the scope myself. I think that would be out of order for me to personally change the scope

*         My personal opinion is that the scope should not include a statement about which MAC/PHY standard should adopt the coexistence standard, so I think such an edit is not the best idea

*         I hope that clarifies the issue


From: Jon Rosdahl []
Sent: Friday, November 20, 2009 7:03 AM
To: Shellhammer, Steve; Wendong Hu; vivek.g.gupta@INTEL.COM
Cc: Bruce Kraemer
Subject: Fw: Rebuttal and feedback to 802.19 and 802.22 on their Response to our PAR comments -- also 802.21

   I failed to cc you on the e-mail I sent to the 802.11 reflector last night about the discussion we will have on our feedback to your responses.
below is the links to the relevant documents.
If I have a pointer to a document from your group that has changed please let me know.

----- Original Message -----
From: Jon Rosdahl<>
Sent: Thursday, November 19, 2009 7:43 PM
Subject: Rebuttal and feedback to 802.19 and 802.22 on their Response to our PAR comments -- also 802.21

   The 802.11 PAR adhoc met today and prepared some rebuttals to the responses from 802.22 and 802.19.  We will discuss these submissions during the Closing Plenary.  I have included pointers to the material that may be of interest in preparing discussion.  802.21 has accepted our comments.

802.11 Comments, feedback and rebuttals

Current 802.19 PAR and 5C

Current 802.22 PAR and 5C

Current 802.22.3 PAR and 5C

The full response from 802.19

The full response from 802.22
802.22 PAR Doc: 22-09-236

802.22.3 PAR Doc: 22-09-237

The updated PAR and 5C can be found at:

The comments and their resolutions can be found at:
Jon Rosdahl                          10871 North 5750 West
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