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Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] Follow-up on the Discussion on NDP Transmission in TF Sounding Phase



Hi Mahmoud.

 

For Method 3, I don't see it practical for AP to perform sensing where it is ‘hard’ to separate out signals from different devices. However, if a vender really wanted to build a very complex AP doing that, then I don't see anything more needed from the standard side - the AP could always choose to allocate the same resource (RU/SS) to multiple devices. So, I do not think this is a topic which needs to be handled in the standards forum as it is more of an AP product differentiation.

 

Regards,

Ali

 

From: Mahmoud Kamel <000019de5e655b6b-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, May 9, 2022 2:03 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [STDS-802-11-TGBF] Follow-up on the Discussion on NDP Transmission in TF Sounding Phase

 

WARNING: This email originated from outside of Qualcomm. Please be wary of any links or attachments, and do not enable macros.

 

Hi all,

 

To follow-up on the discussion we started in contribution 22/0654r0, I share the table below to summarize the methods we presented in the meeting.

Please share your feedback/comments/suggestions to different methods to enable efficient WLAN sensing in various use cases and scenarios, including the one with large number of sensors.

 

The figure below is included for reference.

 

 

Method 1

Method 2a

Method 2b

Method 3

Domain

Time Domain

Frequency Domain

Space Domain

Non-Orthogonal

Legacy Use

Secure/regular LTF in the uplink (Ranging)

Not used in the current standard

HE TB Ranging NDP

Not used in the current standard

Support in the Standard

Supported

Not Supported

Supported

Not Supported

Use cases

Multiple Triggering Sequence in case of large number of triggered sensing responders

Triggering multiple low-end devices (20MHz-only STAs)

Triggering multiple sensors such that each sensor sends the NDP over the entire bandwidth simultaneously 

Coarse efficient sensing in scenarios with a large number of sensing responders

Pros

Simplicity

Support of 20MHz-only STAs

Simplicity

Efficiency

(Support of a large number of sensing responders in the same TXOP)

Potential Problems

  • Inefficient WLAN sensing
  • Limited number of sensing responders in the same TXOP
  • Complex allocation of uplink resources
  • Limited number of sensing responders in the same TXOP
  • Sensing accuracy
  • Power Control
  • Limited number of sensing responders in the same TXOP
  • Power Control
  • Synchronization

 

 

                                                                                            

 

Best regards,

Mahmoud

 

 

From: Mahmoud Kamel
Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2022 6:37 PM
To: Hanxiao (Tony, WT Lab) <0000177ab8f731c4-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: TGbf meeting on April 19, and 21

 

Hi Tony,

 

Please add the contribution below to the agenda for next week.

 

19-Apr-2022 ET

2022

654

0

TGbf

Discussion on NDP Transmission in TF Sounding Phase

Mahmoud Kamel (InterDigital)

20-Apr-2022 11:38:02 ET

Download

 

 

Best Regards,

Mahmoud

 

 

 

From: stds-802-11-tgbf@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <stds-802-11-tgbf@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> On Behalf Of Hanxiao (Tony, WT Lab)
Sent: Monday, April 18, 2022 12:09 PM
To: STDS-802-11-TGBF@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: TGbf meeting on April 19, and 21

 

 

Dear all,

This is a reminder and call for submissions for the upcoming meeting on:   

1. April      19  (Tuesday),  10am - 12:00pm ET

2. April      21  (Thursday), 2300 - 01:00am ET

 

 

Please note:

1.      Please send the agenda request at least 24 hours prior to the call, following the format below:

     DCN, Title, Author (affiliation), Time duration

2.      I will cancel the call if there is no request received 24 hours prior to a call.

3.      Please upload your submissions (revision 0) on mentor 24 hours prior to the meeting so that members would have a chance to review those submissions offline. Otherwise,

1.      If there is not enough time during the meeting, the presentation will be delayed to the next meeting.

2.      If there is enough time during the meeting, the presentation will be moved to the end of the queue and be presented in the end. However, any related SP should be delayed to the next meeting.

4.      Please send the motion request (with related DCN, and SP result) around 10+5 days before the meeting (for teleconference, not for Plenary or Interim meeting), so that the TG chair could send the 10 day advance notice to the 802.11 reflector, after getting the approval from the WG chair.

5.       Dial-in information:

 

April      19  (Tuesday),  10am - 12:00pm ET
Join the Webex meeting here: https://ieeesa.webex.com/ieeesa/j.php?MTID=m9244d36d009ef54b321bf1cf3fa2279b

Meeting number: 234 549 47435

Meeting password: wireless (94735377 from phones and video systems)

Join by phone: Tap to call in from a mobile device (attendees only) +1-408-418-9388 USA Toll
Global call-in numbers

Access code: 234 549 47435

Join from a video system or application Dial 23454947435@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx You can also dial 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number.

Join using Microsoft Lync or Microsoft Skype for Business Dial 23454947435.ieeesa@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Need help? Go to http://help.webex.com

 

 

April      21  (Thursday), 2300 - 01:00am ET
Join the Webex meeting here: https://ieeesa.webex.com/ieeesa/j.php?MTID=mb1ea2e6f8cefd600dd335a94f8b4f309

Meeting number: 234 597 43051

Meeting password: wireless (94735377 from phones and video systems)

Join by phone: Tap to call in from a mobile device (attendees only) +1-408-418-9388 USA Toll
Global call-in numbers

Access code: 234 597 43051

Join from a video system or application Dial 23459743051@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx You can also dial 173.243.2.68 and enter your meeting number.

Join using Microsoft Lync or Microsoft Skype for Business Dial 23459743051.ieeesa@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Need help? Go to http://help.webex.com

 

Best Regards : )

Tony Xiao Han


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