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Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBI] Discussion on EPP element in Association

Hi Antonio and Domenico,

 

Thanks for initiating the discussion on the reflector.

 

I think that the initial issue was the fact that the “AID Storage Size” field is  included in the EPP Epoch Settings element. I thank that this is an error to mix information related to AID and Epoch in the same element, because it is very difficult to harmonize the behavior of the AIDs and the Epochs for different scenarios such as CPE and BPE.

 

For me, the Duration is mandatory to define an Epoch. A solution could be to separate AID information and Epoch settings in different element.

 

As Domenico proposed, I would be also supportive  of an alternative solution specifying the contents of the EPP element included in a (Re)Association request frame such as:

  • CPE shall include (1) Epoch Duration, (2) AID storage size in EPP Epoch Settings Field in EPP Element in Assoc Req
  • BPE shall include AID Storage size and GroupID set to 0 (meaning that STA accepts to join the default group) in EPP Epoch Settings field in EPP Element in Assoc Req

Regards

 

Patrice

 

 

 

From: Domenico Ficara (dficara) <00004e18de6159ef-dmarc-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: mercredi 15 octobre 2025 10:58
To: STDS-802-11-TGBI@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [STDS-802-11-TGBI] Discussion on EPP element in Association

 

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hi Antonio, 

thanks for bringing this up. 

I think the direction we’re going is to have different BPE and CPE subclauses to clarify BPE vs CPE specific behaviours.

 

I have some concerns if we do not include the EPP Element because that would enforce defining some default value or a different behavior for AID storage size determination which might not work for all scenarios and all STAs. 

 

At this point, I would be supportive of your option (1).

An alternative would be a slight variation of (1) where:

  • CPE shall include (1) Epoch Duration, (2) AID storage size in EPP Epoch Settings Field in EPP Element in Assoc Req
  • BPE shall include AID Storage size only in EPP Epoch Settings field in EPP Element in Assoc Req

 

regards

Domenico

 

 

From: Antonio DeLaOlivaDelgado <aoliva@xxxxxxxx>
Date: Tuesday, 14 October 2025 at 18:27
To: STDS-802-11-TGBI@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <STDS-802-11-TGBI@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [STDS-802-11-TGBI] Discussion on EPP element in Association

Dear,

We are having a parallel discussion about the mandatory use of the EPP element in (Re)Association Request frames. We need this to agree on the BPE and CPE operation in clause 10.71.2.2.

- it is true that in the (Re)Association Request frame definition, the EPP element is defined as optional.

- yesterday we agreed on having the EPP element sent (with a shall) in (Re)Association request frames due to the need of sending always the AID storage size in section 10.71.2.2. We need to make this coherent with the definition of the (Re)Association Request frame if we keep it like that.

- the EPP element includes the epoch duration as a mandatory field. When designing this element we decided to always send the most important information for an epoch, its duration. The non-AP declares a will to join a group with this duration, while the AP states the actual duration of the group it assigns the non-AP to.

 

Now, we have an issue with BPE. It looks like BPE aims at having the EPP element included in the (Re)Association Request frame, but only with the AID storage size (if I understood correctly). 

 

I see four options to this, and we need to decide soon since we need to have the text ready asap:

1- We change the EPP Epoch Settings field to not have the Epoch duration as a mandatory field.

2- We declare the EPP element is optional in (Re)Association request frames for BPE and mandatory for CPE.

3- We do not have the EPP element mandatory in (Re)Association Request frames no matter the CPE or BPE.

4- BPE learns to live with the Epoch duration in the EPP element for (Re)Association request frames

 

I would go for #2 to be honest.

 

Thanks

Antonio

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